04/10/1995 01:18 PM House JUD

 HJR 9 - SUIT RE POWS & MIAS AGAINST U.S & OTHERS                            
                                                                               
 SAM GRISWOLD, Legislative Secretary to Representative Jeannette             
 James, Co-sponsor of HJR 9, gave a brief overview of what the                 
 Resolution proposes.  It requests the state of Alaska to file a               
 suit in the United States Supreme Court, joining other states that            
 have already done so.  Basically we would request that all                    
 documentation pertaining to those people missing in action (MIAs)             
 and prisoners of war (POWs) would be released in order to answer              
 the questions in controversy revolving around that issue.                     
                                                                               
 Number 100                                                                    
                                                                               
 NANCY GOURLEY testified via teleconference from Kenai.  She spoke             
 representing her brother who has been missing in action from Laos             
 since February 18, 1971, and also for her uncle who has been a                
 prisoner of war in Korea since July 5, 1950.  Her family has                  
 exhausted all other efforts to obtain a proper accounting of her              
 brother.  The Department of Defense has proposed their theory on              
 the incidents and the recovery of his remains which consisted of a            
 single tooth.  Her family has exhausted all of their efforts to               
 find out what really happened.  They have never claimed it to be              
 probable that he survived this incident, only that it is possible.            
 The information that has been given to them is very  questionable.            
 Documents have been fabricated.  The Department of Defense will               
 confirm that her family has been lied to.  She can prove that.  All           
 in all they have been treated quite poorly as family members, in              
 that they did not hear anything at all from the Department of                 
 Defense for over 20 years in regard to this incident.  The                    
 treatment they received and the information they were provided is             
 less than adequate for her family to feel assured within their own            
 hearts and minds that he has passed on.  They honestly felt that              
 their family was the exception when it first came up.  She did not            
 really dispel what the government was claiming to be true at first.           
 When they met with a number of other families for the first time,             
 they found they were just a part of the rule, that they were no               
 exception, that it was not just them, but it was family after                 
 family after family that had been provided this contrary                      
 information.                                                                  
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOE GREEN asked Ms. Gourley if she had been lied to            
 by the federal government, or by other countries.                             
                                                                               
 MS. GOURLEY answered that she had been lied to by the federal                 
 government.                                                                   
                                                                               
 LEONARD EFTA, an ex-Government Issue (GI), testified via                      
 teleconference from Kenai.  The question that there may be MIAs               
 still living is a little bit more than he can stomach.  He is very            
 glad to see this bill being introduced and hopes it will be                   
 pursued.  He would like to see this issue finished once and for               
 all.                                                                          
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE CYNTHIA TOOHEY asked if there was an investigation             
 conducted about three years ago by the Bush Administration.                   
                                                                               
 MR. EFTA was not sure.                                                        
                                                                               
 MS. GOURLEY answered that there were the Murkowski hearings in                
 1986, in addition to the one that was held three years ago.                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY asked if Ms. Gourley knew the results of                
 those.                                                                        
                                                                               
 MS. GOURLEY said that the Murkowski hearings went up in the air               
 with the Challenger disaster.  It was dropped in a pool of water.             
 The one point they could all agree on is that the United States did           
 leave live prisoners of war behind and that their fate is unknown.            
 That was the only undisputed point, however, no action has been               
 taken to pursue that issue.                                                   
                                                                               
 SUSAN ROSS testified via teleconference.  Her father served in                
 World War II, and her brother served in the Vietnam War.  Neither             
 of them became an MIA or a POW, but she has two sons that would be            
 draft age right now, should the draft be reinstated.  Her concern             
 as a patriot is the cynicism on the part of our citizens regarding            
 the treatment of veterans.  This is relative to the cutback of                
 deficits, the experimentation conducted on military personnel which           
 has come to light in the media, and the apparent abandonment of               
 servicemen in various campaigns.  She felt that getting behind a              
 bill like this would certainly put back a lot of confidence in the            
 minds and hearts of the people, not only those who have served, but           
 people such as her sons who might be called upon.  Those people               
 would certainly think twice about whether or not to serve their               
 country when the payoff they will receive is to be abandoned to a             
 hostile country by the people who were chosen to protect them as              
 they were protecting our rights.  She fully supports this bill.               
                                                                               
 GARY TYNDALL testified via teleconference from Fairbanks.  He is in           
 favor of HJR 9.  Similar Resolutions have been passed in 37 states            
 so far.  This one is appropriate for Alaska because of our very               
 large veteran population, because we have a number of POW and MIA             
 family members in Alaska, and because of the high value that we as            
 Alaskans place on freedom.  In 1973, near the close of the war,               
 there were peace talks in which our United States government asked            
 for the return of over 3700 POWs/MIAs by name.  These were not                
 deserters, nor people who just vanished, but they were known or               
 suspected to be in the enemy hands.  We only got back 591.  Three             
 weeks later, the rest of these (over 3100), who we had reason to              
 believe were alive, were declared officially dead.  They were                 
 written off and abandoned.  There was no explanation for this                 
 conclusion or as to why their status had changed.  Now, even more             
 than 22 years later, a report was filed that had never even been              
 opened.  These people were just simply abandoned.  In the last                
 couple of years, some elements of the government have admitted that           
 some Americans were left behind alive.  We have proven electronic             
 and photo intelligence to that effect.  They had defector                     
 debriefings in both the Asian and Eastern European countries.                 
 There have been live sightings by refugees, by Europeans working in           
 Southeast Asia.                                                               
                                                                               
 MR. TYNDALL explained there are also those Vietnamese that know a             
 lot more than they admit.  For instance, they selectively                     
 segregated prisoners, and kept detailed records of captures,                  
 losses, and shoot-downs.  They even went so far as to early                   
 excavate grave sites immediately after the event in order to store            
 American remains.  It is an old practice to use prisoners and                 
 remains as bargaining chips, as they did a long time ago with the             
 French.  The records show pretty clearly that prisoners can survive           
 for many years in captivity.  For example, just a couple of years             
 ago, the Soviets released a bunch of Japanese World War II                    
 prisoners.  Just last year we had the testimony of our own long               
 term POWs that were returned in 1973.  I think all the evidence               
 should be examined before declaring a missing prisoner dead.  This            
 should be established for our own country's future.  The families             
 have a right to examine this evidence.  It is still locked up after           
 20 or more years.  Some of it has even been shredded when asked for           
 by investigators or Senate committees.  This Resolution has the               
 effect of Alaska's willingness to join with other states in                   
 petitioning to reaffirm these basic American rights.  He encouraged           
 the Judiciary Committee's unanimous endorsement.                              
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY made a motion to adopt the committee                    
 substitute version of the Resolution, which clarifies a section on            
 page 3, lines 10 - 14, but does not alter the substance.  Seeing no           
 objection, CSHJR 9, Version K, was adopted.                                   
                                                                               
 Number 350                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY made a motion to move CSHJR 9(JUD), Version             
 K, out of committee with individual recommendations and zero fiscal           
 notes.  Seeing no objection, it was so ordered.